Partisan Magazine gives voice to Afghan Revolutionaries

What has changed in Afghanistan since 2000 and 20 years ?

Well, after September 11 when the United States and NATO troops invaded Afghanistan, sent its military troops and started establishment of their bases in Afghanistan, it was all done by the support of fundamentalist jihadists, especially the Northern Alliance. We have always said that fighting on terror and fighting against fundamentalism would not be possible by relying on another fundamentalist group. What the United States and NATO did in Afghanistan when they invaded our country was to justify their military presence by using the false slogans of war on terror, women’s rights, and democracy. But practically they backed and supported and brought in power the most corrupt criminal jihadists. That’s why in the past 20 years, there was no improvement in the life of Afghan people. There was no improvement in the security situation, women’s safety, or economic development. Afghanistan received millions of dollars as aids from the world. But unfortunately, it filled the pockets of the warlords, it filled the pockets of the high position government leaders, it filled the pockets of the fundamentalist leaders, terrorists and criminals. The billions of dollars of aid turned Afghanistan to be known as the most corrupt and drug-ridden state in the world. Also these 20 years provided an excellent opportunity for the drug dealers and mafia to become the highest producer of opium in the world.

And of course, that has only been possible with the support of the United States because they did enter Afghanistan under the slogan of combating terrorism. Meanwhile, the police, the military, the administration, the system they made in Afghanistan was extremely corrupt and run by mafia dealers. And quite obviously the US government and the military private contractors majorly profited from it.

Sahar Saba explained to us in 2002 that with each change of regime the Afghan people hoped for an improvement in their lives and they each time were disappointed in the arrival of the Soviet Army in its departure and in 2001 with the US intervention. What is your assessment today of the withdrawal of the US imperialist army now ?

Well, I think that in the last 40 years, Afghanistan has always been in a war, either under direct or indirect attack whether it was under the occupation of the former Soviet Union or their puppet regimes. Khalq and Parcham, the two Soviet-backed regimes have committed many crimes and human rights abuses. They were responsible for killing tens of thousands of people, arresting, and executing of progressive activists, Marxists, Maoists and many revolutionary groups and organizations whose leaders were killed by this regime. At the same time, United States was supporting the Islamic fundamentalists and terrorist organizations through the Pakistan’s intelligences and Saudi Arabia’s funding. CIA was pumping millions of dollars for their political and military support so they could then fight against the Soviets. Let us not forget that the European governments, including French government, was directly involvement under the flag of NATO and sent their military forces and established their bases in Afghanistan to fulfill their own interests and implement their policies.

These 20 years also turned Afghanistan into a testing ground, where US military tested its most potent and dangerous weapons and explosives. For example, the famous mother of all bombs, which is considered secondary to the atomic bomb, exploded in the Nangarhar province, killing many innocent people. There are reports that the lands are non-arable, and that many children have been born with birth defects not seen before. But of course, these western governments do not care about what’s happening to the people of Afghanistan. The lives of Afghan people have no value. Their involvement is to only protect their own agendas and their own interests Today we see that Russia and China are also using religious extremism as their most important ally to fight against democratic, progressive, secular, and leftist movements and organizations. This is the reason why the involvement of the US imperialism has only brought miseries, pains, and tragedies to the Afghans. The 100 years of United States imperialism bears evidence that wherever they have invaded or interfered or occupied, has resulted in dictatorship, bloodshed, war, and utter and complete destruction of the country’s economy.

From the very first days when the Northern Alliance looters and killers were installed back into power in 2002 to the last so-called peace talks, deals and agreements in Doha and release of 5000 terrorists from the prisons in 2020/21, it was obvious that the Taliban will come in power. All imperialist powers invade countries for their own strategic, political and financial interests but through lies and the powerful corporate media try to hide their real motives and agendas. Everything was done according to a deal to handover Afghanistan to Taliban. The US govt. negotiating with Pakistan and other regional players had agreement to form a govt. mainly composed of Taliban. So, the soldiers were not ready to be killed in a war that they knew there was no benefit of the Afghan people in it because finally it is set behind closed doors to bring Taliban to power. Zalmay Khalilzad is highly hated among Afghan people due to his treacherous role in bringing the Taliban back to power.

What is the attitude of the US competitors, the Russians and Chinese ? Turkey, Iran and Pakistan ? What about them ?

Each of these countries have their own interests and their own agendas in Afghanistan. But among them, of course, everybody knows about the role of CIA in Afghanistan. You may know the book called Devil’s Game by Robert Dreyfuss which talks about the strong relationship between CIA and the Afghan fundamentalists, he calls it an open secret. However, the world knows little about the deep involvement of the Iranian regime in all these years. We share the same language the same religion of the Hazara minorities and this dirty theocratic regime has always supported the Islamic fundamentalists in Afghanistan. They have many intellectuals, writers and poets on their payroll that shamelessly demand for a federal system and even balkanization because of the ongoing Hazara genocide. However, we believe these inter-ethnic and inter-religious enmities are only fueled by these foreign powers to always keep Afghans disunited. On the contrary, if we see the history of Afghanistan, different ethnicities and religions have lived in peace and harmony for hundreds of years and it has always been used by British colonizers, later the Soviets and today the US imperialism and Iranian theocracy to “divide and rule”.

RAWA believes that only a nation which is united regardless of its religious or ethnic backgrounds where everyone is considered and treated equal, only then is it possible to rise against Islamic fundamentalism and fight for freedom and democracy.

Turkey has been very much involved in supporting the corrupt system for the past 20 years by running aid agencies and schools. Their schools have trained a generation of elite and educated students but extremely religious and conservative. The nature of Erdogan’s regime is quite obvious when we see what they do against the freedom-loving revolutionaries in Turkey and they have the same policies in Afghanistan too, masqueraded with the beautiful banner of humanitarian aid and support. Pakistan’s support to the Taliban has been evident in these 40 years and they have consistently provided a haven for majority of these fundamentalists, who were born and trained by the Pakistani intelligence. But today, the of Russia and China is very important. Unfortunately, China throughout the Soviet rule were supporting fundamentalists. It’s even said that China officially welcomed Gulbuddin Hekmatyar during the Soviet war and throughout all these years had secret links with these fundamentalist groups by considering them champions of war against Soviet Union, rather than hard-core radicals.

What are we dealing with today : Russia and China want to make ties with the Taliban today to mainly fight against the US. So I can simply say that Afghanistan will sooner or later turn into a battleground of war between the US imperialism on one side and China, Russia and Iran on the other side. United States will never leave Afghanistan because they still have very strong and deep roots and interests in our country and using it against China and Russia. They are now fully supporting ISIS in Afghanistan so as to create a new terrorist organization in case the Taliban become sold-outs, and particularly in the northern Afghanistan so as to use them as a threat to Russia. Russian and Chinese governments will make any disgraceful deal with the Taliban, as long as they fulfill their own motives and interests.

Where is Rawa in the country ? Is it possible to stay ? In which regions you return ? What are your activities ? Schooling, refugees, aid, mobilizations, clandestine meetings ? Is it possible to understand ?

RAWA was founded by our leader Meena in the year 1977, she was later assassinated by the fundamentalists and pro-Soviet KHAD. It was mainly formed and established as a political organization of women. That’s why we say that we are the first political and feminist group in Afghanistan that emerged with a very clear and strong message of combating not just occupation but also struggling against fundamentalism and against religious extremism. From the very beginning RAWA’s slogan was independence from foreign occupation and breaking the fundamentalist chains in a very male-dominated and feudal society. We started as an independent group of women and believed that the discrimination and abuse against women can only be fought by changing the political system. Therefore, we called ourselves “revolutionary” because we wanted a deep political change. We demand a secular and democratic system which can guarantee justice regardless of gender, ethnicity, or religion. Fighting for secular democracy in Afghanistan, got us the title of “infidels” by the fundamentalist groups.

But RAWA used all the possible ways to educate women through different programs, organizing meetings and demonstrations in schools and the university during the 70s. Up until now, we use all the possible means to communicate with women and mobilize and organize them, starting with educating them. When we talk about education, it usually starts with basic literary courses and with time, we inform them about the social and political situations and raise their political consciousness. It is important for them to be confident and autonomous and consider themselves equal to men. Since the time the Taliban have closed the doors of schools for girls, RAWA has started home-based classes for girls and women and to provide them the possibilities to learn English, Mathematics and different scientific subjects. We actively run schools and classes, but none of them can be operated under the name of RAWA. Demonstrations, public meetings for different occasions, humanitarian projects such as education projects, schools, orphanages, and mobile healthcare teams are never done openly under RAWA’s name. Even the RAWA members like me who appear in public and do interviews and give speeches, we never use our real names and do not allow to be photographed. We should not be recognized because we are based and work in Afghanistan and it is one of the ways to protect ourselves from these Jehadi fundamentalists and now the Taliban.

Are there any serious democratic forces in Afghanistan with whom you can work more or less openly ? What do you think of Zarifa Ghafari (former Mayor of Maydan Shahr) who is much told about in the media ?

There are some democratic groups, but as I told you that these democratic and progressive groups in Afghanistan are very weak because they have been persecuted from both sides, first by the Pro-Soviet regime, and then the pro-US fundamentalist groups. There is a long list of politicians, poets, writers, artists, and Marxists who have been assassinated or arrested from their homes and disappeared without a trace. Their mothers, sisters, fiancés, wives, and children still await their return because they can never believe it, they never saw their dead bodies. One of their murderers is Gulbuddin Hekmatyar who is famously known as the “butcher of Kabul” and his hands are stained in the blood of countless young, democratic, bright intellectuals and activists. These groups never had the opportunities like RAWA to work openly. That’s why today, if we observe the political scenario in Afghanistan, unfortunately, fundamentalists grow stronger every day because they enjoy the international funding and support, and these democratic and revolutionary groups became weaker every day. However, there are some organizations that are still present and work in Afghanistan like Solidarity Party of Afghanistan (SPA) and Afghan Liberation Organization (ALO), a Marxist-Leninist organization.

RAWA’s slogan has always been that all revolutionary, democratic and progressive movements should come together to make a strong front by getting the support of the masses of Afghanistan, especially the downtrodden, from all over Afghanistan. They should unitedly fight against foreign occupation and fundamentalism, and we hope that this will happen one day like it is happening in Iran today. The only way out for the Afghan crisis is a united uprising of the masses of Afghanistan, including men and women. People like Zarifa Ghafari and many other women who have been vastly publicized and are portrayed as the female leaders from Afghanistan. Unfortunately, they have never been independent, they are somehow supported by the Western governments and introduced by the Western governments.

In the Wikileaks, there were many secret documents about Afghanistan. One interesting document was that the European governments proposed in 2002-2003 that new Afghan female faces should be introduced as part of the new government. This is how several women were promoted by the Western media and supported by Western governments. They became famous, they received awards and are still widely popular. They held important positions in the Karzai’s government. However, at that time, the entire government was under the direct control of CIA. And this was one of their important agendas to appoint female leaders. The main aim was to fool the world that the US has brought democracy and gender equality in Afghanistan by installing some dolls in the parliament. Zarifa Ghafari was unfortunately chosen as an International Woman of Courage in 2020 by the US Secretary of State, which in our opinion, is a symbolic award.

Unfortunately, most of the women like Fawzia Koofi, Shukria Barakzai, Habiba Sarabi, Naheed Farid, Shaharzad Akbar, Mary Akrami and several others are hyped by the Western media and have been invited as part of many important meetings and gatherings of Afghanistan here in Europe, but they do not represent the real Afghan women because they have never been a part of the fight against fundamentalism and imperialism who are the most important enemies.

What is your assessment on the refugees who are flying the country, both economic refugees and those who have gone into exile following the return of the Talibans ? It is difficult to leave ? Is it expensive to leave ? What is the difference between the two types of exists ? Do they hope to return ?

Well, I think the horrific airport scene after 15th August 2021 was a big tragedy, seeing people hanging from the military planes at the cost of their lives just to flee Afghanistan was very painful to see. But it proves the level of the chaos that was created by the United States, and most of the people believe that if the US leaves Afghanistan life will end here. Afghanistan suffered a huge brain drain when the US decided to evacuate some of the brightest, most skilled, educated, and young individuals. Of course, as far as we know, majority of these people left Afghanistan because of the economic and political situation and knew that with the Taliban the situation will only worsen.

Of course, it’s very expensive and majority of those who are reaching European or American countries are the elitists, who have the financial abilities and means to leave Afghanistan. Majority of the poor and miserable people, even those who worked with the US forces are left behind. Many low-rank soldiers of the past government, police officers, female lawyers, judges, teachers and government employees who have worked and continuously risked their lives, could not leave Afghanistan because they simply did not have the money. Many of them have been threatened, attacked and even killed anonymously.

So again, this was all part of a big game played by the Western governments to portray themselves as champions and protectors of human rights. However, we do not believe this as from even the smallest decision that they make, they always look for their own benefits.

What do you think of those activists, especially in France, who praised the warlord Massood because the Taliban killed him in 2001 ?

Well, I think it is very important to speak about this especially in France because it has been very active, and probably the biggest supporter Ahmed Shah Massood, this fundamentalist criminal, starting from the Soviet war. The reason that he became such a well-known hero or the “lion of Panjshir”, was because of the direct military and technical support that he received from the French government during the anti-Soviet war. Furthermore, the French government sent many journalists, writers and documentary filmmakers to make him more popular. However, they always tried to hide the fact that he is one of the leaders of Jamiat-e Islami Party, which is a fundamentalist and terrorist group, not ideologically different from the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. Apart from the French government, they also enjoyed direct financial and military support from CIA, ISI, Mossad and other intelligences. Ahmad Shah Massoud and Gulbuddin Hekmatyar were among the rebels trained by Naseerullah Babar, a prominent Pakistani army officer. In 1975, Babar trained rebels who staged their first uprising in Panjshir valley. This proves the very close ties that they had with their ISI masters. Jamiat-e Islami and Massood himself was also close to Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, Haqqani network and Al-Qaeda. So I cannot understand how some French people and even leftists can call him a democratic or a hero. He is being white washed as pro-women, progressive and open-minded whereas in reality he has the exact same mentality and nature as that of other fundamentalist and misogynist elements. For example, he was against secular democracy and elections, considering it an “infidel” ideology.

It is even plainly mentioned in his book that his wife has not been seen by any male strangers. This only shows his misogyny and narrow-mindedness. And now continuing the same mission, the French government is playing the same game, hyping Ahmad Massoud, the son of Ahmed Shah Massood, as the hero of war against Taliban, as the only alternative, as the only way out, as the only option or solution to the future of Afghanistan. Meanwhile they are forgetting that at the beginning Taliban takeover, Ahmad Massood was happy to have a fair share in the government. First, he demanded 50% of the seats in the Taliban government and then later, during the negotiations, he settled down for 30%. Even if now the Taliban gives them positions and seats, they will happily join them. If they are now fighting the Taliban is because they want to attract the attention of the CIA, and the European governments to receive more financial and military assistance. It has been quoted in New York Times as well. A representative of Ahmad Massoud in the United States contacted CIA, asking for more military aid to combat Taliban. He was also very close to Qassem Soleimani, a fundamentalist military leader from Iran who was killed by the American forces. It is said that his father Ahmed Shah Massoud, had very close ties of friendship and money with this dirty fundamentalist. Therefore, all this proves that he is no different than the Taliban, he is equally misogynist, fundamentalist, terrorist and a hireling to the US, France and Iran.

That’s very important. When are the political forces obviously condescend fighting for a free and democratic Afghanistan, free from foreign interference ?

As I mentioned before, progressive movements exist. They work the same clandestine way as RAWA. They are weak but it doesn’t mean that they have completely vanished. We hope that one day they will be empowered, mobilized and more organized with the support of the masses. And of course each one of them needs support from all the international justice-seeking, progressive and freedom-loving organizations. The anti-imperialist, anti-capitalist and anti-colonialism forces should show their solidarity and give direct support to the local clandestine groups in Afghanistan, many intellectuals and political activists left Afghanistan, but few groups like RAWA and several others, have stayed back and kept this keep commitment and promise to the most oppressed masses of Afghanistan, to never leave them alone and fight with them one day. However, this is a very difficult and critical moment of the history, and we will only hope one day we see glorious uprisings by our people just like Iran today.

Okay, two small questions. What is your assessment of the women’s struggling in Iran and what impact might this have on the struggle in Afghanistan ?

We have always been amazed, inspired, and awe-struck by the courage of these Iranian women and men and their struggles in these 40 years. We have always said that the Iranian women are always in the forefront of fighting against the theocratic Iranian regime and today we see their fight is successful against the Islamic fundamentalism. Looking back at the history of female activism in Iran, most of the leftist, progressive and revolutionary groups in Iran had a large number of female activists, the prisons of Iran were always full with female political prisoners and several well-known female leaders have been killed or executed by the blood-thirsty SAVAK. We continue to learn and be inspired. For more than 40 years, Iranian people were under the tyrannical rule of the fundamentalist Islamic regime. Now, primarily the women have risen and are leading the fight. The current uprising of Iranian women is not just about Hijab or the headscarf, but about a deep political change. RAWA will always stand by them, support them, expressed its solidarity, and even organized a protest in front of the Iranian embassy in Kabul under the extremely dangerous threats from the Taliban.
Still we went ahead and chanted the same slogan as the Iranian activists : Women, Life, Freedom. Another of the placards said : Today Iran, tomorrow it is our turn to rise against the Islamic fundamentalism. It was the least we could do for our Iranian sisters.

The last question : What support do you expect from democratic and anti-imperialist forces around the world ?

Well, to say it very briefly, I think raising awareness, spreading correct/verified information and knowing better the situation of Afghanistan, because I know that the Afghan situation is very complicated and the mainstream media does a bad job in describing it. I would advise you to be cautious of who is really representing Afghan people, because many of them are somehow linked to the government and intelligences. It is always better to have direct and firsthand information from the organizations and activists living inside Afghanistan and to organize awareness campaigns, public meetings, conferences, demonstrations, cultural events etc. Our people question the French government when they named a street after Ahmad Shah Masood, they said instead of denouncing him and exposing his real fundamentalist and criminal nature, he is being celebrated !

Unfortunately, we didn’t see any reactions from the revolutionary groups here in France. And this is the smallest thing that they can do for the Afghan people, to denounce this street’s name and demand its immediate change. Our organization, RAWA, never receives funds from big organizations, NGOs or any government, but has always relied on the small amount of donations sent to us from all over world and help us raise the voices of Afghan women. It should always be mentioned by the media, including the social media, through interviews, meetings etc. that it is your financial support that keeps us going. Short tours like the one you organized for me is also very important. And we hope that in the future more tours like this will be organized so we will have a chance to bring our members, which would give a real and true picture of Afghanistan, not the one showed by the French media.

Okay, thank you very much. Is there a question we don’t ask for and important for you ?

The most important thing is that now several European governments, especially the French government, talks about the establishment of inclusive government. For them, the only negative point in the current administration of Taliban is that it is made up of only Pashtuns ! Even if they bring some burqa-clad women in their cabinet, or some criminals from the Hazaras, Tajiks or Uzbeks, the nature and essence of the Taliban will never change. They would still be fascist, terrorist, fundamentalist, misogynist in nature. And the only solution is to uproot this fundamentalism and fight against their imperialist masters for a free, liberal, democratic and secular Afghanistan.